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	<title>Comments on: The biased leading the blind</title>
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	<description>Global warming and the future of New Zealand</description>
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		<title>By: Rob Taylor</title>
		<link>http://hot-topic.co.nz/the-biased-leading-the-blind/comment-page-1/#comment-7445</link>
		<dc:creator>Rob Taylor</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 06 Oct 2009 07:08:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hot-topic.co.nz/?p=3117#comment-7445</guid>
		<description>Roger, if you  think the climate is cooling, I suggest you holiday in the Victorian bush this summer and invite your denialist colleagues over for a barbie.

Meanwhile, scores of  millions of people are afflicted by climate instability from global heating today, with much worse to come. 

Frankly, your irresponsibility and lack of compassion is sickening.

Do you not have children? or a conscience? or a clue?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Roger, if you  think the climate is cooling, I suggest you holiday in the Victorian bush this summer and invite your denialist colleagues over for a barbie.</p>
<p>Meanwhile, scores of  millions of people are afflicted by climate instability from global heating today, with much worse to come. </p>
<p>Frankly, your irresponsibility and lack of compassion is sickening.</p>
<p>Do you not have children? or a conscience? or a clue?</p>
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		<title>By: samv</title>
		<link>http://hot-topic.co.nz/the-biased-leading-the-blind/comment-page-1/#comment-7292</link>
		<dc:creator>samv</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Sep 2009 03:32:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hot-topic.co.nz/?p=3117#comment-7292</guid>
		<description>You&#039;re beginning to blather incomprehensibly, but bear in mind it&#039;s not consensus of the general population, that&#039;s pretty darned near impossible for contentious issues.  It&#039;s consensus of those educated in the topic.  Those who have taken their viewpoint, subjected it with an open but skeptical mind to the rigour of analysis by their peers, investigated things which are out of line and discovered what they can agree upon, with what certainty.

And note consensus is not the same as the law of the majority.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You&#8217;re beginning to blather incomprehensibly, but bear in mind it&#8217;s not consensus of the general population, that&#8217;s pretty darned near impossible for contentious issues.  It&#8217;s consensus of those educated in the topic.  Those who have taken their viewpoint, subjected it with an open but skeptical mind to the rigour of analysis by their peers, investigated things which are out of line and discovered what they can agree upon, with what certainty.</p>
<p>And note consensus is not the same as the law of the majority.</p>
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		<title>By: Roger Dewhurst</title>
		<link>http://hot-topic.co.nz/the-biased-leading-the-blind/comment-page-1/#comment-7291</link>
		<dc:creator>Roger Dewhurst</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Sep 2009 03:22:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hot-topic.co.nz/?p=3117#comment-7291</guid>
		<description>CONSENSUS............  Do you remember the word?  Who claims consensus on this issue?

Hung by your own petard I believe.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>CONSENSUS&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;  Do you remember the word?  Who claims consensus on this issue?</p>
<p>Hung by your own petard I believe.</p>
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		<title>By: samv</title>
		<link>http://hot-topic.co.nz/the-biased-leading-the-blind/comment-page-1/#comment-7290</link>
		<dc:creator>samv</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Sep 2009 02:55:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hot-topic.co.nz/?p=3117#comment-7290</guid>
		<description>In matters of conscience, the law of majority has no place.
 -- Mahatma Gandhi

(I put forward: &quot;and science&quot; belongs after &quot;conscience&quot;)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In matters of conscience, the law of majority has no place.<br />
 &#8212; Mahatma Gandhi</p>
<p>(I put forward: &#8220;and science&#8221; belongs after &#8220;conscience&#8221;)</p>
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		<title>By: Roger Dewhurst</title>
		<link>http://hot-topic.co.nz/the-biased-leading-the-blind/comment-page-1/#comment-7289</link>
		<dc:creator>Roger Dewhurst</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Sep 2009 00:27:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hot-topic.co.nz/?p=3117#comment-7289</guid>
		<description>Sorry 20.5%.  That 0.5% is pretty significant given your level of support.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry 20.5%.  That 0.5% is pretty significant given your level of support.</p>
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		<title>By: Roger Dewhurst</title>
		<link>http://hot-topic.co.nz/the-biased-leading-the-blind/comment-page-1/#comment-7288</link>
		<dc:creator>Roger Dewhurst</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Sep 2009 00:26:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hot-topic.co.nz/?p=3117#comment-7288</guid>
		<description>20.% for your viewpoint.
71.9% for mine.

The British public have not swallowed your story.  I suspect the percentages here would run against you even more.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>20.% for your viewpoint.<br />
71.9% for mine.</p>
<p>The British public have not swallowed your story.  I suspect the percentages here would run against you even more.</p>
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		<title>By: samv</title>
		<link>http://hot-topic.co.nz/the-biased-leading-the-blind/comment-page-1/#comment-7287</link>
		<dc:creator>samv</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Sep 2009 00:25:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hot-topic.co.nz/?p=3117#comment-7287</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;It is no use just pointing to IPCC reports written by bureaucrats...&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Come, now.  With language like this:

&lt;blockquote&gt;COâ‚‚ and Oâ‚‚ compete for the reaction sites on the photosynthetic carbon-fixing enzyme, ... The strength of the response of photosynthesis to an increase in COâ‚‚ concentration depends on the photosynthetic pathway used by the plant....Plants with the Câ‚„ photosynthetic pathway (tropical and many temperate grasses, some desert shrubs, and some crops including maize and sugar cane) already have a mechanism to concentrate COâ‚‚ and therefore show either no direct photo-synthetic response, or less response than Câ‚ƒ plants (Wand et al., 1999).&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Find me a beurocrat who can &lt;em&gt;understand&lt;/em&gt; that, let alone claim to have &lt;em&gt;authored&lt;/em&gt; it!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>It is no use just pointing to IPCC reports written by bureaucrats&#8230;</p></blockquote>
<p>Come, now.  With language like this:</p>
<blockquote><p>COâ‚‚ and Oâ‚‚ compete for the reaction sites on the photosynthetic carbon-fixing enzyme, &#8230; The strength of the response of photosynthesis to an increase in COâ‚‚ concentration depends on the photosynthetic pathway used by the plant&#8230;.Plants with the Câ‚„ photosynthetic pathway (tropical and many temperate grasses, some desert shrubs, and some crops including maize and sugar cane) already have a mechanism to concentrate COâ‚‚ and therefore show either no direct photo-synthetic response, or less response than Câ‚ƒ plants (Wand et al., 1999).</p></blockquote>
<p>Find me a beurocrat who can <em>understand</em> that, let alone claim to have <em>authored</em> it!</p>
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		<title>By: samv</title>
		<link>http://hot-topic.co.nz/the-biased-leading-the-blind/comment-page-1/#comment-7286</link>
		<dc:creator>samv</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Sep 2009 00:19:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hot-topic.co.nz/?p=3117#comment-7286</guid>
		<description>Yes but the temperature&#039;s going down where?  As measured by whom?  You meant you opened the door and a draft blew in?

Depending on the nature of that answer, it&#039;s either the &quot;&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.skepticalscience.com/global-warming-cold-weather.htm&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;It&#039;s Freakin&#039; Cold!&lt;/a&gt;&quot; argument, or cherry picking a short timescale.  Both of these positions deny or ignore the extensive body of knowledge about the world&#039;s weather systems.

&lt;blockquote&gt;Itâ€™s hard for ordinary people to have any faith in the dangerous global warming scenario right now. Thereâ€™s no sign of danger.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Glaciers going from magnificent to piddly within a person&#039;s lifetime.  Droughts and severe record-breaking heat spells.  Melting permafrost with methane bubbling out from underneath.  Long-lived sea ice in the Arctic disappearing.  These are all signs, and most people (who are happy to trust the judgment of scientists working in the respective fields) see them as such.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes but the temperature&#8217;s going down where?  As measured by whom?  You meant you opened the door and a draft blew in?</p>
<p>Depending on the nature of that answer, it&#8217;s either the &#8220;<a href="http://www.skepticalscience.com/global-warming-cold-weather.htm" rel="nofollow">It&#8217;s Freakin&#8217; Cold!</a>&#8221; argument, or cherry picking a short timescale.  Both of these positions deny or ignore the extensive body of knowledge about the world&#8217;s weather systems.</p>
<blockquote><p>Itâ€™s hard for ordinary people to have any faith in the dangerous global warming scenario right now. Thereâ€™s no sign of danger.</p></blockquote>
<p>Glaciers going from magnificent to piddly within a person&#8217;s lifetime.  Droughts and severe record-breaking heat spells.  Melting permafrost with methane bubbling out from underneath.  Long-lived sea ice in the Arctic disappearing.  These are all signs, and most people (who are happy to trust the judgment of scientists working in the respective fields) see them as such.</p>
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		<title>By: samv</title>
		<link>http://hot-topic.co.nz/the-biased-leading-the-blind/comment-page-1/#comment-7285</link>
		<dc:creator>samv</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Sep 2009 00:09:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hot-topic.co.nz/?p=3117#comment-7285</guid>
		<description>&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.grida.no/CLIMATE/IPCC_TAR/WG1/fig3-1.htm&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;not&lt;/a&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://www.grida.no/CLIMATE/IPCC_TAR/WG1/fig3-1.htm" rel="nofollow">not</a></p>
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		<title>By: Gareth</title>
		<link>http://hot-topic.co.nz/the-biased-leading-the-blind/comment-page-1/#comment-7284</link>
		<dc:creator>Gareth</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Sep 2009 00:02:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hot-topic.co.nz/?p=3117#comment-7284</guid>
		<description>I know that&#039;s the impression you&#039;d like to create Roger, but it simply doesn&#039;t bear scrutiny. The world has moved on, and you&#039;ve been left behind.

Carter and de Freitas don&#039;t make &quot;arguments&quot;, they misrepresent the facts to attempt to make arguments. Once that&#039;s pointed out, they&#039;re shown up for what they are -- crude propagandists becoming ever more shrill in their support of the untenable.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I know that&#8217;s the impression you&#8217;d like to create Roger, but it simply doesn&#8217;t bear scrutiny. The world has moved on, and you&#8217;ve been left behind.</p>
<p>Carter and de Freitas don&#8217;t make &#8220;arguments&#8221;, they misrepresent the facts to attempt to make arguments. Once that&#8217;s pointed out, they&#8217;re shown up for what they are &#8212; crude propagandists becoming ever more shrill in their support of the untenable.</p>
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